Niccolò: My name is Niccolò Cipriani, I am the founder of Rifò and now I am the CEO. Rifò is a circular fashion brand based in Prato specializing in recycling all clothes and textiles and to make garments that are biodegradable, recyclable, and made to last. 

Interviewer: Could you give me an overview of how Rifò was founded and what are your leading principles? 

N: So, Rifò was founded in 2017, November, with a crowdfunding campaign and the idea was to create garments and accessories made with recycled materials here in Prato. So, the values of Rifò are local production, recycled materials, and also to create social impact projects in this territory. 

I: Rifò works to carry out textile recycling traditions of the Prato region. For your company, what is the role of the cenciaioli and how do they collaborate with your company today?

N: Well the role of cenciaoli is crucial for us as they are the first of the supply chain, in the sense that they are the ones who give us the opportunity to do what we do. So, it’s a tradition that we want to maintain. And it’s also a tradition that we want to regenerate. 

N: They do sorting, by quality and colors, and they give a possibility to the old clothes to be recycled and to be transformed into new material and the new garment again. 

I: And I know Rifò has a more collaborative project with different manufacturers or different factories where they work directly with the cenciaioli. Could you describe how exactly this works and how you got to the point of having, you know, a more collaborative project that supports migrants or young workers to develop this craft? 

N: We collaborate with many cenciaioli here, working with them directly because they’re part of the Nostri Pani Project. So we work with them because we give them the opportunity to have a trainee that normally is a vulnerable migrant. And to have it, let’s say, at a good fair. Like, they pay the intern 300 euro and the rest is paid by the project. So the intern gets 1,100 euro, 800 from the project and 300 from the company. So, it’s a good opportunity for them to maintain their skills and not to lose competencies. 

I: So, during this project is the mentorship or the training mainly led by the factory that employs them or does Rifò directly support this aspect of the work? 

N: There is one month of [...] training program led by CINEA about security, all the things you need to know to be inside the company and then the Italian language course. And then six months in the field with the company. It’s a training-ship. 

I: Okay. So after this training internship period is finished, does Rifò maintain a presence in their [...] work experience or the development of their work full time? 

N: Well, after one month they can become full-time or not. In case they don’t become, we help them to find new opportunities. If they become full-time, we just maybe, one per year, if the situation is fine, if it’s okay, and so on. 

I: Ah, okay. So jumping back to more of the direct Rifò business, your materials are all recycled or recyclable. What are the different challenges faced by Rifò when sourcing recycled fibers vs dead-stock fabrics? 

N: [Our] Core value is recycling. So, we are focused on recycling. Each month we realized to have at least 20% recycled fiber. If we can, there should always be 100% but it’s not always possible. Even if like, with technology, we see that there is an increase in recycled content in the composition we find, when we cannot find a recycled fabrics, recycled yarn, we use dead-stock materials. So we use them for categories of design that we cannot do otherwise. So like for shirts, pants, normal cotton, thin materials. 

I: So definitely a smaller percentage of your production? 

N: Yes, exactly. I think it’s maybe not even 1% of our production. It’s still small. We want to increase it but it’s still small. 

I: Okay yes, that makes sense. And in general, because there are many places in Prato where either fibers from post-consumer production or from factory waste are being recycled, such as the ones where cenciaioli are sorting from many different streams. Do you find working with recycled materials from different factories that it’s difficult to verify or trace the supply chain or is it easier than expected?

N: It depends. Maybe in the last period it’s easier because traceability is becoming a priority, but not always. So let’s say, like, in 70% of the cases you know the region and also the treatments [the fibers] have undergone. In the rest of the cases, no. You don’t always have a traceability of that. 

I: How many partners, if you can say, do you have along your supply chain and what would you say is the significance of your relationship with these partners? 

N: We have I think around 90 partners, you can see them in the sustainability report that we will publish at the end of April. I would say they are all important because you need them, anyway. 

I: And are all of those based in Prato or the Florence region? 

N: 95% of them, yes. 

I: And Rifò is a smaller business with an origin in circularity. Many brands, with the regulations that are coming out in July for the Digital Product Passport and more specific regulations, they claim that due to their size or the existing infrastructure that implementing circular or more conscious practices into the supply chain is extremely difficult or impossible. What are your thoughts based on your experience with Rifò? 

N: There are many limits, but you have to embrace them. In the sense that it’s not impossible, it’s difficult, but at the same time it’s feasible. It’s not something that [is] bigger than ourselves, and it’s a lot of belief and conviction that that’s the new way. 

N: Of course, it’s not as simple as producing with virgin material, producing in Bangladesh, because it’s more expensive and you have to explain the value of what you use. So, it takes more time and more effort for sure. 

I: Right. Because part of my efforts in highlighting Rifò and similar businesses is to show that you can have a fully transparent company that’s focused on circularity and recycling, that’s also profitable, that has a team that’s growing and that has collaborations with young people or migrant workers who are trying to support the next generation in learning these practices and implementing them across the industry. So, I’m trying to emphasize that it is possible. 

N: I think it’s easier for smaller size brands. For bigger size [brands], they need a real revolution. So of course it can take more time and it’s more risky. 

I: Okay, yes that makes sense. And for those who are unfamiliar with natural fibers or textile recycling, could you explain the steps in the process from a recycled garment to a new textile for Rifò specifically? 

N: You can see it in the student kit [on the Rifò website], so you can have all of the information there. But it is sorting, quality, so we can understand the composition, like if there is synthetic fibers mixed with natural fibers. Then, color sorting you do [...] you divide by color so you don’t overdye. Then you do chemical testing in case there are hazardous chemicals from previous productions inside. Then you do shredding. It can be water shredding or mechanical shredding. Then you card the fiber, so you spin the fiber, and in the end it can be for fabrics or for knitting. And then from knitting, like, you make the sweater and from fabric you make the fabric and then you craft to make a coat, a jacket, or what else. 

I: What would you say are the biggest challenges facing Rifò? 

N: I think there are two. The first one is, like, the quality of the materials that arrive are less and less of high quality. So, we need to be careful about what we can recycle and how we can recycle. The second one is price because people are used to focus[ing] on price instead of value. So we need to create awareness, we need to educate people towards a more responsible consumption. 

I: A lot of companies I’ve observed that have a buyback service, a repair service, or even a pathway to receive some type of discount or incentive for returning or exchanging damaged clothing have reduced over time. They’ve reduced either in terms of the amount of locations that carry out these activities or the associated incentives. From what I know, Rifò has a strong repair service in place. Has this service presented issues or problems, or is it harder to maintain than expected? 

N: Well it’s not easy because it’s a tricky process to monitor and manage. But with time we are more and more familiar with it. It takes time to build this, [to] rebuild these competencies, because it’s not easy to find them in the market. At the same time, I think it will create added value in the long term. Like when we started we always thought about ourselves, but now there are companies asking us to do it for them. But sofar we are focusing on ourselves.

I: What are the key values that new and existing brands should focus on to work towards a more circular future? 

N: I think a responsibility in general in terms of not overproducing, not over consuming. So, it’s not only about recycling dead stock materials, it’s about how you produce them, how you sell them, and how you consume them. 

I: When you think of the future of fashion what do you imagine? Are you hopeful? 

N: I think it needs a shift. It cannot have the volumes it has had in the last 10 years. So I hope it will reduce, in terms of volumes. It should focus more on quality instead of quantity. So many in terms of job opportunities they will be the same in numbers, but the jobs will be different. I think you need regulations, but I think at the end we are the ones who decide what to buy, what to wear. So it needs both: regulations and people [who are] more aware of the impact. I hope it will change for the better, but I don’t hope it will fail as a sector. It can do fashion, but in a responsible way. 

I: So, right now you are focused on a certain type of customer that has these values, and you’re hoping to grow this customer base, or you are trying to reach new customers and convert them? 

N: We do both. We focus on the customers that are really eager to buy a product [that is] sustainable, responsible. At the same time, we work, especially with the newer generation, to build those values and that awareness. So we do both.

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This interview could not have been possible without the collaboration of the entire Rifò team. A special thanks to Niccolò and to all those who helped share the Rifò story.